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	<title>Comments on: Is the founder of Ubuntu a male chauvinist?</title>
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	<link>http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/is-the-founder-of-ubuntu-a-male-chauvinist/</link>
	<description>I Hack and Tweak Everything</description>
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		<title>By: playfish</title>
		<link>http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/is-the-founder-of-ubuntu-a-male-chauvinist/comment-page-1/#comment-1181</link>
		<dc:creator>playfish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Mar 2010 07:18:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/?p=357#comment-1181</guid>
		<description>i was beginning to feel i would probably end up being the only lady which cared about this, at the least now i know im not nuts :) i&#039;ll be sure to take a look at a number of several other articles just after i get my morning caffeine in me, it is really stressful to read with out my coffee, I was really late last evening playing facebook poker and after having a few beers i wound up burning off all my zynga poker chips take care :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i was beginning to feel i would probably end up being the only lady which cared about this, at the least now i know im not nuts <img src='http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  i&#8217;ll be sure to take a look at a number of several other articles just after i get my morning caffeine in me, it is really stressful to read with out my coffee, I was really late last evening playing facebook poker and after having a few beers i wound up burning off all my zynga poker chips take care <img src='http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Bob the Chef</title>
		<link>http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/is-the-founder-of-ubuntu-a-male-chauvinist/comment-page-1/#comment-1174</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob the Chef</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Mar 2010 16:30:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/?p=357#comment-1174</guid>
		<description>Tom, women are more sensible than men in general. God. All men do is try to measure up all the time, like a bunch of 13 year old schoolboys. I&#039;ve only met a few mature men in my life who I find worthy of respect. The rest are like a bunch of scared, chest-banging (either physically or mentally) wankers who seem to have a deep-seated fear of vaginas, like they have teeth or something. Technical subjects are easy as pie compared to some of the &quot;fuzzier&quot; subjects women are allegedly better at. von Neumann even make that observation. It&#039;s easy to reason about clearly defined things. A computer can do it. What&#039;s difficult is reasoning about the ineffable. You, sir, are a tard. Have you even considered that perhaps your powers of explanation suck? It&#039;s quite frequently the case among engineers. I&#039;m surprised you even have a wife. Maybe she is as dumb as you say. But to have this sense of male superiority, how lame. I&#039;m as dismissive of feminism as the next guy, but male chauvinism is just so juvenile. Grow a pair.

Mark, how crafty, using the homophobe card. You&#039;re in the same boat as Tom. Accusing Tom of being a closet homosexual is not homophobia. It&#039;s accusing Tom of being a closet homosexual -- that&#039;s it! Members of the gay community, such as Dan Savage, routinely lambaste closet homosexuals. It&#039;s the denial that&#039;s being chiefly attacked, and the hateful ways it manifests itself, not homosexuals themselves. You are a troll just like Tom, or at the very least, an intellectual buffoon who should be locked int the same prison cell with him. You&#039;re one of those people that accuses terrorists of racism whenever a black man is killed in a bombing simply because a black man was among the 30 victims. Grow a brain.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom, women are more sensible than men in general. God. All men do is try to measure up all the time, like a bunch of 13 year old schoolboys. I&#8217;ve only met a few mature men in my life who I find worthy of respect. The rest are like a bunch of scared, chest-banging (either physically or mentally) wankers who seem to have a deep-seated fear of vaginas, like they have teeth or something. Technical subjects are easy as pie compared to some of the &#8220;fuzzier&#8221; subjects women are allegedly better at. von Neumann even make that observation. It&#8217;s easy to reason about clearly defined things. A computer can do it. What&#8217;s difficult is reasoning about the ineffable. You, sir, are a tard. Have you even considered that perhaps your powers of explanation suck? It&#8217;s quite frequently the case among engineers. I&#8217;m surprised you even have a wife. Maybe she is as dumb as you say. But to have this sense of male superiority, how lame. I&#8217;m as dismissive of feminism as the next guy, but male chauvinism is just so juvenile. Grow a pair.</p>
<p>Mark, how crafty, using the homophobe card. You&#8217;re in the same boat as Tom. Accusing Tom of being a closet homosexual is not homophobia. It&#8217;s accusing Tom of being a closet homosexual &#8212; that&#8217;s it! Members of the gay community, such as Dan Savage, routinely lambaste closet homosexuals. It&#8217;s the denial that&#8217;s being chiefly attacked, and the hateful ways it manifests itself, not homosexuals themselves. You are a troll just like Tom, or at the very least, an intellectual buffoon who should be locked int the same prison cell with him. You&#8217;re one of those people that accuses terrorists of racism whenever a black man is killed in a bombing simply because a black man was among the 30 victims. Grow a brain.</p>
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		<title>By: Umair</title>
		<link>http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/is-the-founder-of-ubuntu-a-male-chauvinist/comment-page-1/#comment-313</link>
		<dc:creator>Umair</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Oct 2009 11:13:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/?p=357#comment-313</guid>
		<description>If he only said linux is hard to explain to girls, I dont understand why that is such a big issue. Because linux is hard to explain to non-techies, both guys and girls. Since most techies are guys, the statement that linux is hard to explain to girls simply means that it is hard to explain to non-techies. We can&#039;t assume that he meant it in a sexist way.

I am a non-techie and a new Ubuntu user and guess whose tutorials I have found to be among the most helpful? A girl&#039;s!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If he only said linux is hard to explain to girls, I dont understand why that is such a big issue. Because linux is hard to explain to non-techies, both guys and girls. Since most techies are guys, the statement that linux is hard to explain to girls simply means that it is hard to explain to non-techies. We can&#8217;t assume that he meant it in a sexist way.</p>
<p>I am a non-techie and a new Ubuntu user and guess whose tutorials I have found to be among the most helpful? A girl&#8217;s!</p>
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		<title>By: Carolyn Jewel</title>
		<link>http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/is-the-founder-of-ubuntu-a-male-chauvinist/comment-page-1/#comment-233</link>
		<dc:creator>Carolyn Jewel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Oct 2009 21:25:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/?p=357#comment-233</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;
perhaps this is why most women don’t choose engineering or software development as careers
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

As a woman in technology and out in the working world for a while now, I think it has more to do with what happens to women in this culture. Less respect, less pay, harassment on the job and career penalties for child-bearing. If society is, subtly and not so subtly (see @tom above) telling you you&#039;re not capable, is it any wonder if some women believe it?

As for @Tom, maybe is wife really isn&#039;t capable of computer literacy. That doesn&#039;t make her stupid. Or maybe, given his attitude, she has no interest in learning about it. I wouldn&#039;t care to learn from someone who calls me stupid. In fact, it might be quite impossible to learn from someone like that.

You get back what you put in -- if you go through life convinced that women are stupid and inferior, all the women who aren&#039;t -- most of us I&#039;d say -- will stay away from you and for you, the world looks like what you believe it is. And there&#039;s the common result that all the women who don&#039;t fit your stereotype will be denied or explained away.

People say thoughtless things all the time and maybe Mark Shuttleworth was merely thoughtless. And yet, what is his mind set such that a thoughtless moment produces a comment like that? And how many women hear something like that and decide they&#039;ll stay the heck away from a profession where women are denigrated? No wonder women stay out of technology. In droves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>
perhaps this is why most women don’t choose engineering or software development as careers
</p></blockquote>
<p>As a woman in technology and out in the working world for a while now, I think it has more to do with what happens to women in this culture. Less respect, less pay, harassment on the job and career penalties for child-bearing. If society is, subtly and not so subtly (see @tom above) telling you you&#8217;re not capable, is it any wonder if some women believe it?</p>
<p>As for @Tom, maybe is wife really isn&#8217;t capable of computer literacy. That doesn&#8217;t make her stupid. Or maybe, given his attitude, she has no interest in learning about it. I wouldn&#8217;t care to learn from someone who calls me stupid. In fact, it might be quite impossible to learn from someone like that.</p>
<p>You get back what you put in &#8212; if you go through life convinced that women are stupid and inferior, all the women who aren&#8217;t &#8212; most of us I&#8217;d say &#8212; will stay away from you and for you, the world looks like what you believe it is. And there&#8217;s the common result that all the women who don&#8217;t fit your stereotype will be denied or explained away.</p>
<p>People say thoughtless things all the time and maybe Mark Shuttleworth was merely thoughtless. And yet, what is his mind set such that a thoughtless moment produces a comment like that? And how many women hear something like that and decide they&#8217;ll stay the heck away from a profession where women are denigrated? No wonder women stay out of technology. In droves.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin Prince</title>
		<link>http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/is-the-founder-of-ubuntu-a-male-chauvinist/comment-page-1/#comment-227</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Prince</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Oct 2009 04:15:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/?p=357#comment-227</guid>
		<description>Amen. You people need to STFU and get a life, like maybe go back to writing COBOL or whatever it is you do. And by the way, Windows XP and Windows 7 are currently the best OS&#039;s out there. Ubuntu is just a project made up of things that aren&#039;t theirs even though they imply they are. Use Fedora if you&#039;re going to use Llinux - CEntOS on your Linux servers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amen. You people need to STFU and get a life, like maybe go back to writing COBOL or whatever it is you do. And by the way, Windows XP and Windows 7 are currently the best OS&#8217;s out there. Ubuntu is just a project made up of things that aren&#8217;t theirs even though they imply they are. Use Fedora if you&#8217;re going to use Llinux &#8211; CEntOS on your Linux servers.</p>
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		<title>By: YaSamY</title>
		<link>http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/is-the-founder-of-ubuntu-a-male-chauvinist/comment-page-1/#comment-226</link>
		<dc:creator>YaSamY</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Oct 2009 04:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/?p=357#comment-226</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the post dude, it&#039;s good that you&#039;re looking into some of the issues of the industry and not just turning a blind eye to it. I&#039;m going to digg your article and check out GF...

By the way, Bill Bartmann is a legitimate business person technically. I read about him somewhere in the blogosphere but he&#039;s one of those network marketing guys, so spam is synonymous with him. I get spam in my inbox daily from Bill.

Good comments by Mark and Mackenzie too btw.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the post dude, it&#8217;s good that you&#8217;re looking into some of the issues of the industry and not just turning a blind eye to it. I&#8217;m going to digg your article and check out GF&#8230;</p>
<p>By the way, Bill Bartmann is a legitimate business person technically. I read about him somewhere in the blogosphere but he&#8217;s one of those network marketing guys, so spam is synonymous with him. I get spam in my inbox daily from Bill.</p>
<p>Good comments by Mark and Mackenzie too btw.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom F</title>
		<link>http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/is-the-founder-of-ubuntu-a-male-chauvinist/comment-page-1/#comment-223</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom F</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Oct 2009 23:04:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/?p=357#comment-223</guid>
		<description>OK, I&#039;m not &quot;trolling&quot; just becuase I&#039;m blunt about the issue. Alyssa is though. I have the right to say my opinion and I don&#039;t think your comment makes much sense either Mark since you called me a neantreatal. So funny that you are okay with name calling but as soon as someone makes a gay joke or says something slightly abrasive towards women losers like you get all bent out of shape. Feminists and gay rights people need to calm down and quit trying to force issues and micro manage other people it&#039;s annoying.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK, I&#8217;m not &#8220;trolling&#8221; just becuase I&#8217;m blunt about the issue. Alyssa is though. I have the right to say my opinion and I don&#8217;t think your comment makes much sense either Mark since you called me a neantreatal. So funny that you are okay with name calling but as soon as someone makes a gay joke or says something slightly abrasive towards women losers like you get all bent out of shape. Feminists and gay rights people need to calm down and quit trying to force issues and micro manage other people it&#8217;s annoying.</p>
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		<title>By: John Herish</title>
		<link>http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/is-the-founder-of-ubuntu-a-male-chauvinist/comment-page-1/#comment-222</link>
		<dc:creator>John Herish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Oct 2009 18:03:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/?p=357#comment-222</guid>
		<description>I feel like it&#039;s pretty dumb that this has been taken to the point it has been. If he posted something that was insulting women continuously, or even made a really negative remark, then I could see some backlash being deserved. But to be completely honest, I&#039;m sure Linux is hard to explain to girls, and probably to most guys as well. Let me know when he stops allowing women to download his free software and starts donating money to Anti-Feminist groups. Until then, find something better to do with your time people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I feel like it&#8217;s pretty dumb that this has been taken to the point it has been. If he posted something that was insulting women continuously, or even made a really negative remark, then I could see some backlash being deserved. But to be completely honest, I&#8217;m sure Linux is hard to explain to girls, and probably to most guys as well. Let me know when he stops allowing women to download his free software and starts donating money to Anti-Feminist groups. Until then, find something better to do with your time people.</p>
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		<title>By: Randy</title>
		<link>http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/is-the-founder-of-ubuntu-a-male-chauvinist/comment-page-1/#comment-217</link>
		<dc:creator>Randy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 04:36:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/?p=357#comment-217</guid>
		<description>Yes, I&#039;ve taken the time to read over some of the writings on GF and I find that they are reasonable and rational for the most part. It&#039;s great to see feminists take an objective stance on issues that maybe even enrage them on the inside.

I believe what Mark Terranova and what Ryan said are correct. Any person in a position of power or prestige is looked upon by a large audience and therefore has an inherent responsibility to do the right thing. Mark Shuttleworth has done a lot of &quot;good&quot; things, but folks if we look at his personal expenditures objectively, there are better causes that the money could have gone to. I could name dozens off the top of my head but that is not the point. I think actions speak louder than words and Shuttleworth has a track record of doing self-gratifying things as opposed to selfless deeds. Ubuntu Linux is his little baby, whether it&#039;s a great OS/Project/Contribution or not. He also paid an absurd amount to fly to space, and lives at the top of the world.

I hypothesize that Mark is chauvinistic to some extent, but has hidden it rather well throughout the years. He&#039;s also probably not anywhere near a bad case of it. If you can just meditate for a while and think as freely of your own bias as you can about what kind of person Shuttleworth is given his track record and past actions you will find the truth about his character.

Think analytically, just make sure it&#039;s &quot;outside the box&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, I&#8217;ve taken the time to read over some of the writings on GF and I find that they are reasonable and rational for the most part. It&#8217;s great to see feminists take an objective stance on issues that maybe even enrage them on the inside.</p>
<p>I believe what Mark Terranova and what Ryan said are correct. Any person in a position of power or prestige is looked upon by a large audience and therefore has an inherent responsibility to do the right thing. Mark Shuttleworth has done a lot of &#8220;good&#8221; things, but folks if we look at his personal expenditures objectively, there are better causes that the money could have gone to. I could name dozens off the top of my head but that is not the point. I think actions speak louder than words and Shuttleworth has a track record of doing self-gratifying things as opposed to selfless deeds. Ubuntu Linux is his little baby, whether it&#8217;s a great OS/Project/Contribution or not. He also paid an absurd amount to fly to space, and lives at the top of the world.</p>
<p>I hypothesize that Mark is chauvinistic to some extent, but has hidden it rather well throughout the years. He&#8217;s also probably not anywhere near a bad case of it. If you can just meditate for a while and think as freely of your own bias as you can about what kind of person Shuttleworth is given his track record and past actions you will find the truth about his character.</p>
<p>Think analytically, just make sure it&#8217;s &#8220;outside the box&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Ubuntu 10.10 Needs to see Canonical Making More Friends</title>
		<link>http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/is-the-founder-of-ubuntu-a-male-chauvinist/comment-page-1/#comment-216</link>
		<dc:creator>Ubuntu 10.10 Needs to see Canonical Making More Friends</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Sep 2009 01:03:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.eloquentspace.net/blog/?p=357#comment-216</guid>
		<description>[...] girls.&#8221;  Some in the Linux community have taken this opportunity to question whether or not Shuttleworth is a chauvinist, while others have gone so far as to discuss boycotting [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] girls.&#8221;  Some in the Linux community have taken this opportunity to question whether or not Shuttleworth is a chauvinist, while others have gone so far as to discuss boycotting [...]</p>
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